I tried to help a fat guy I know diet. His idea of dieting was to eat carrots, and salad covered in croutons. He refused to get a food scale or when at a restaurant, to ask for the nutrition info. So I have no idea how much he actually eats because he is so stubborn and self-deluded. I know for sure he doesn't even try to count calories and I know for sure he secretly eats junk because he hasn't lost weight on carrots and salads yet. He only eats salads a restaurants too so who really knows (not even him). I talked to him about this. I asked him to count calories and when I checked in he was only counting things with labels on them. So those carrots and calorie high salads are out the window! And he won't even try different veggies, maddening.